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	<title>Comments on: Swashbuckling Under Pressure</title>
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	<description>The musings of Martin "FredFredrickson" Crownover</description>
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		<title>By: Zakreon</title>
		<link>http://blog.martincrownover.com/2009/04/21/swashbuckling-under-pressure/comment-page-1/#comment-4925</link>
		<dc:creator>Zakreon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2009 23:50:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.martincrownover.com/?p=1087#comment-4925</guid>
		<description>I didn&#039;t say they should ignore them, all I&#039;m saying is they should of lined up more than one site to take down at one time, sort of like going for an obvious show-offy drug dealer, which would only make the worst of them go into hiding or start to cover their bases.

Less piracy by the volume? Trying checking out warez-bb.com
Its pretty much worse because the download speeds are higher and its much much easier to find what a pirate wants.

They are going to go after the hidden sites, and I know they always bust one every now and then. But these are always the small ones. I&#039;ve never heard them bust open a huge case and taking out multiple heavily trafficked underground sites.

It wasn&#039;t even reduced overnight. The site was only down four hours, and even in that time, everyone&#039;s torrents were still downloading. The only people who stopped pirating were those who were going to stop before the case happened.

Too many sites are heavily linked to other sites, and pirating sites aren&#039;t exempt from this. Even if people found out their favorite pirating site is gone, they will already know about another they can use just as well. The volume is increasing far faster than its decreasing, so something a bit more drastic needs to be done. Otherwise it really is futile.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I didn&#8217;t say they should ignore them, all I&#8217;m saying is they should of lined up more than one site to take down at one time, sort of like going for an obvious show-offy drug dealer, which would only make the worst of them go into hiding or start to cover their bases.</p>
<p>Less piracy by the volume? Trying checking out warez-bb.com<br />
Its pretty much worse because the download speeds are higher and its much much easier to find what a pirate wants.</p>
<p>They are going to go after the hidden sites, and I know they always bust one every now and then. But these are always the small ones. I&#8217;ve never heard them bust open a huge case and taking out multiple heavily trafficked underground sites.</p>
<p>It wasn&#8217;t even reduced overnight. The site was only down four hours, and even in that time, everyone&#8217;s torrents were still downloading. The only people who stopped pirating were those who were going to stop before the case happened.</p>
<p>Too many sites are heavily linked to other sites, and pirating sites aren&#8217;t exempt from this. Even if people found out their favorite pirating site is gone, they will already know about another they can use just as well. The volume is increasing far faster than its decreasing, so something a bit more drastic needs to be done. Otherwise it really is futile.</p>
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		<title>By: kc lc</title>
		<link>http://blog.martincrownover.com/2009/04/21/swashbuckling-under-pressure/comment-page-1/#comment-4881</link>
		<dc:creator>kc lc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 02 May 2009 13:07:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.martincrownover.com/?p=1087#comment-4881</guid>
		<description>Zakreon, I don&#039;t agree with any of your conclusions.  Yes, law enforcement went after the &quot;low hanging fruit&quot; first.  Why not?  Should they ignore TPB&#039;s massive lawbreaking just because other offenders MAY be worse?  That makes no sense.

Second, those hidden sites you mention almost certainly support LESS piracy by volume.  Almost by definition, less-well-known sites will support less piracy than well-known sites.

Third, what makes you think law enforcement isn&#039;t going after hidden sites?  For example, law enforcement routinely busts child-pornography rings that use hidden sites.

Fourth, how do you conclude the TPB prosecution was futile?  The amount of piracy was reduced OVERNIGHT when they unplugged the servers.  Of course, this won&#039;t stop some users from finding other ways to steal -- but it reduces the volume.

It&#039;s foolish to expect any single prosecution will eliminate piracy.  But every one reduces the volume.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Zakreon, I don&#8217;t agree with any of your conclusions.  Yes, law enforcement went after the &#8220;low hanging fruit&#8221; first.  Why not?  Should they ignore TPB&#8217;s massive lawbreaking just because other offenders MAY be worse?  That makes no sense.</p>
<p>Second, those hidden sites you mention almost certainly support LESS piracy by volume.  Almost by definition, less-well-known sites will support less piracy than well-known sites.</p>
<p>Third, what makes you think law enforcement isn&#8217;t going after hidden sites?  For example, law enforcement routinely busts child-pornography rings that use hidden sites.</p>
<p>Fourth, how do you conclude the TPB prosecution was futile?  The amount of piracy was reduced OVERNIGHT when they unplugged the servers.  Of course, this won&#8217;t stop some users from finding other ways to steal &#8212; but it reduces the volume.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s foolish to expect any single prosecution will eliminate piracy.  But every one reduces the volume.</p>
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		<title>By: Zakreon</title>
		<link>http://blog.martincrownover.com/2009/04/21/swashbuckling-under-pressure/comment-page-1/#comment-4875</link>
		<dc:creator>Zakreon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 23:37:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.martincrownover.com/?p=1087#comment-4875</guid>
		<description>Ok, maybe their defense wasn&#039;t the best. But what about the fact they are going after TPB anyway. There are much worse sites out there, the fact that TPB has a simple search engine just makes it the most obvious. High speed file hosting sites such as Rapidshare and Megaupload easily get away with hosting the illegal files themselves, and the reason they can get away with it is because its a lot harder to find files using it, unless someone gives you a direct link.

Because TPB is under attack, and not one of the sites with the bulk of the illegality hidden, it&#039;s only encouraging sites to start cutting off public access. If they instead went after a site that was a lot less open, it would show the rest of sites that hiding from the law is harder than they thought, and might even have an impact on the amount of piracy.

As it is, it doesn&#039;t seem like the case has done anything at all. I seriously doubt anyone will be scared away from pirating, and that other sites will be even touched anytime soon. Its almost as if the government was trying to show it can crack down on Piracy, but even when it seems they won, it was just an act of futility.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ok, maybe their defense wasn&#8217;t the best. But what about the fact they are going after TPB anyway. There are much worse sites out there, the fact that TPB has a simple search engine just makes it the most obvious. High speed file hosting sites such as Rapidshare and Megaupload easily get away with hosting the illegal files themselves, and the reason they can get away with it is because its a lot harder to find files using it, unless someone gives you a direct link.</p>
<p>Because TPB is under attack, and not one of the sites with the bulk of the illegality hidden, it&#8217;s only encouraging sites to start cutting off public access. If they instead went after a site that was a lot less open, it would show the rest of sites that hiding from the law is harder than they thought, and might even have an impact on the amount of piracy.</p>
<p>As it is, it doesn&#8217;t seem like the case has done anything at all. I seriously doubt anyone will be scared away from pirating, and that other sites will be even touched anytime soon. Its almost as if the government was trying to show it can crack down on Piracy, but even when it seems they won, it was just an act of futility.</p>
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		<title>By: kc lc</title>
		<link>http://blog.martincrownover.com/2009/04/21/swashbuckling-under-pressure/comment-page-1/#comment-4863</link>
		<dc:creator>kc lc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 15:41:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.martincrownover.com/?p=1087#comment-4863</guid>
		<description>Would such a sign have saved them?  I&#039;m not sure either, but they were damned fools NOT to have one.  And if they&#039;d made a token effort to periodically purge some illegal links, I doubt their punishment would&#039;ve been so harsh.  

But they were very arrogant, and thumbed their noses at the law.  And their defense was little more than a technicality.  They didn&#039;t even claim they were unaware of illegal content -- only that THEY weren&#039;t the ones making the transfers.

What an incredibly stupid defense. lol...   All the prosecutors had to show, was that TPB had KNOWLEDGE of illegal activity, and they had INTENT to facilitate it.  Cased closed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Would such a sign have saved them?  I&#8217;m not sure either, but they were damned fools NOT to have one.  And if they&#8217;d made a token effort to periodically purge some illegal links, I doubt their punishment would&#8217;ve been so harsh.  </p>
<p>But they were very arrogant, and thumbed their noses at the law.  And their defense was little more than a technicality.  They didn&#8217;t even claim they were unaware of illegal content &#8212; only that THEY weren&#8217;t the ones making the transfers.</p>
<p>What an incredibly stupid defense. lol&#8230;   All the prosecutors had to show, was that TPB had KNOWLEDGE of illegal activity, and they had INTENT to facilitate it.  Cased closed.</p>
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		<title>By: FredFredrickson</title>
		<link>http://blog.martincrownover.com/2009/04/21/swashbuckling-under-pressure/comment-page-1/#comment-4861</link>
		<dc:creator>FredFredrickson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 06:37:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.martincrownover.com/?p=1087#comment-4861</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m not sure I agree with the Ford analogy, Zakreon.  I think that more directly, it&#039;s like a guy who owns a shop where people come to meet and swap illegal goods.  Sure, it&#039;s not the owner&#039;s fault if someone who happens to be on his property decides to commit a crime; but if the owner knows this is going on and encourages it, then there is some responsibility there.  That is exactly why TPB got in trouble - they knowingly enabled people to commit a crime.

Does that mean that merely putting up a big sign that says &quot;DO NOT POST ILLEGAL STUFF HERE&quot; would have saved them from a guilty verdict?  I&#039;m not sure about that...  but the lack of any such sign is damning, surely.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m not sure I agree with the Ford analogy, Zakreon.  I think that more directly, it&#8217;s like a guy who owns a shop where people come to meet and swap illegal goods.  Sure, it&#8217;s not the owner&#8217;s fault if someone who happens to be on his property decides to commit a crime; but if the owner knows this is going on and encourages it, then there is some responsibility there.  That is exactly why TPB got in trouble &#8211; they knowingly enabled people to commit a crime.</p>
<p>Does that mean that merely putting up a big sign that says &#8220;DO NOT POST ILLEGAL STUFF HERE&#8221; would have saved them from a guilty verdict?  I&#8217;m not sure about that&#8230;  but the lack of any such sign is damning, surely.</p>
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		<title>By: Zakreon</title>
		<link>http://blog.martincrownover.com/2009/04/21/swashbuckling-under-pressure/comment-page-1/#comment-4858</link>
		<dc:creator>Zakreon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 May 2009 05:03:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.martincrownover.com/?p=1087#comment-4858</guid>
		<description>I sadly have to say that I the merchant&#039;s ships any time I can. But its the only way I can stay connected with one of the greatest joys there is, new software on a computer. And having absolutely no money (practically ever), makes such a task hard to accomplish.

This isn&#039;t to say I&#039;m die hard take everything. I bought all my Steam games, I have a whole shelf full of boxes and lone discs of old and new games alike, but most of my software is acquired from the bowels of the internet.

And we even talked about the legality of them being shut down during class today, and their defense makes sense. If some guy buys a Ford and mows down a bunch of little kids, is Ford going to be the one in trouble, or even whoever sold the guy the car? No, its the drivers fault. If anything, its just a lack of moderation by TPB&#039;s staff, and last time I checked, bad moderation isn&#039;t illegal.

And now I feel bad for 2D Boy...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I sadly have to say that I the merchant&#8217;s ships any time I can. But its the only way I can stay connected with one of the greatest joys there is, new software on a computer. And having absolutely no money (practically ever), makes such a task hard to accomplish.</p>
<p>This isn&#8217;t to say I&#8217;m die hard take everything. I bought all my Steam games, I have a whole shelf full of boxes and lone discs of old and new games alike, but most of my software is acquired from the bowels of the internet.</p>
<p>And we even talked about the legality of them being shut down during class today, and their defense makes sense. If some guy buys a Ford and mows down a bunch of little kids, is Ford going to be the one in trouble, or even whoever sold the guy the car? No, its the drivers fault. If anything, its just a lack of moderation by TPB&#8217;s staff, and last time I checked, bad moderation isn&#8217;t illegal.</p>
<p>And now I feel bad for 2D Boy&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: FredFredrickson</title>
		<link>http://blog.martincrownover.com/2009/04/21/swashbuckling-under-pressure/comment-page-1/#comment-4854</link>
		<dc:creator>FredFredrickson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:57:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.martincrownover.com/?p=1087#comment-4854</guid>
		<description>I agree, Xot.  Fair use is an important part of the equation, and I think it helps creative industries more than it could ever hurt them.  I think I recently read somewhere about a member of the music industry asking YouTube to remove a video of a baby (dancing, maybe?) because their song could be heard in the background.  I&#039;m not exactly sure why they felt this would hurt their sales / image, but to me, it just goes to show you that many people in the music industry just don&#039;t get it.

It&#039;s too bad about TurboSquid and Boeing.  It kinda makes me wonder how games like Grand Theft Auto can get away with using car models that are virtually identical to their real-life counterparts seemingly with no licensing cost or disputes.

As far as copyright length goes, I can see both sides of the argument.  It seems only right that anything created by someone should eventually fall into the public domain, long after it has benefited its creator.  This is the best course for the good of everyone.  But then, I also feel like the times have changed and this sort of law isn&#039;t really applicable to the large franchises that have sprung up over the last century.  Wouldn&#039;t Mickey Mouse himself fall into the public domain as well?  I&#039;m probably ignoring some important part of the equation here, hehe.

However they decide to change copyright law, I just hope that we can eventually come to some sort of middle ground between pirates and producers.  Piracy is becoming too rampant a crime to ignore, and if things don&#039;t get fixed soon I am afraid that lawmakers, who are second only to the RIAA in being out of touch with technology, will clamp down on the internet and ruin the freedom of the whole thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree, Xot.  Fair use is an important part of the equation, and I think it helps creative industries more than it could ever hurt them.  I think I recently read somewhere about a member of the music industry asking YouTube to remove a video of a baby (dancing, maybe?) because their song could be heard in the background.  I&#8217;m not exactly sure why they felt this would hurt their sales / image, but to me, it just goes to show you that many people in the music industry just don&#8217;t get it.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s too bad about TurboSquid and Boeing.  It kinda makes me wonder how games like Grand Theft Auto can get away with using car models that are virtually identical to their real-life counterparts seemingly with no licensing cost or disputes.</p>
<p>As far as copyright length goes, I can see both sides of the argument.  It seems only right that anything created by someone should eventually fall into the public domain, long after it has benefited its creator.  This is the best course for the good of everyone.  But then, I also feel like the times have changed and this sort of law isn&#8217;t really applicable to the large franchises that have sprung up over the last century.  Wouldn&#8217;t Mickey Mouse himself fall into the public domain as well?  I&#8217;m probably ignoring some important part of the equation here, hehe.</p>
<p>However they decide to change copyright law, I just hope that we can eventually come to some sort of middle ground between pirates and producers.  Piracy is becoming too rampant a crime to ignore, and if things don&#8217;t get fixed soon I am afraid that lawmakers, who are second only to the RIAA in being out of touch with technology, will clamp down on the internet and ruin the freedom of the whole thing.</p>
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		<title>By: FredFredrickson</title>
		<link>http://blog.martincrownover.com/2009/04/21/swashbuckling-under-pressure/comment-page-1/#comment-4853</link>
		<dc:creator>FredFredrickson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 14:40:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.martincrownover.com/?p=1087#comment-4853</guid>
		<description>Aviraldg, I think you&#039;re looking at this the wrong way.  Giving away books that you own is entirely different from copying and distributing music / movies on a wide scale.  Whereas the book is just a single copy, and by giving it away you lose your copy, file sharing isn&#039;t the same.  You make an exact copy of your file, and instead of giving it to one other person, you are giving it to millions.  Surely you can see how that would be different.

Imagine I have a device that can scan and duplicate anything you give me.  You give me an old  book, and I run it through the machine, and instantly I have an infinite amount of that book.  Suddenly, the book is no longer valuable.  Everyone can have a copy for free, and there is no reason to actually go out and buy the book.  The book publisher would be very upset, and rightfully so, because his entire business is gone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aviraldg, I think you&#8217;re looking at this the wrong way.  Giving away books that you own is entirely different from copying and distributing music / movies on a wide scale.  Whereas the book is just a single copy, and by giving it away you lose your copy, file sharing isn&#8217;t the same.  You make an exact copy of your file, and instead of giving it to one other person, you are giving it to millions.  Surely you can see how that would be different.</p>
<p>Imagine I have a device that can scan and duplicate anything you give me.  You give me an old  book, and I run it through the machine, and instantly I have an infinite amount of that book.  Suddenly, the book is no longer valuable.  Everyone can have a copy for free, and there is no reason to actually go out and buy the book.  The book publisher would be very upset, and rightfully so, because his entire business is gone.</p>
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		<title>By: Aviraldg</title>
		<link>http://blog.martincrownover.com/2009/04/21/swashbuckling-under-pressure/comment-page-1/#comment-4850</link>
		<dc:creator>Aviraldg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 10:21:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.martincrownover.com/?p=1087#comment-4850</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m black beard. No , really. Yesterday I handed my friend about a dozen novels I was done with and on past occasions , we&#039;ve done a lot of similar stuff. And no , I&#039;m not sorry for the [u]millions[/u] of dollars that Archer and Pan Publishing lost due to our little charade. Even after all this , they haven&#039;t knocked on my door yet. I believe they won&#039;t be  doing so soon.

Every industry has to face it , and draw a line between &quot;lending&quot; and &quot;piracy&quot;. Let&#039;s say , I dump a pile of books outside my door and put up a post it note , &quot;These books do [u]not[/u] belong to me. Pick up at your own risk. May be radioactive.&quot; That is in no way illegal. The piratebay guys were doing something similar. Essentially , piracy should not be illegal , but it is and will always be morally wrong , and so it should be stopped , as that&#039;s even more reason for companies (think Redmond) to make things heavily DRM laden. Additionally , if nothing is done soon , governments like The Government , will be making laws that will stop piracy. And our three fundamental freedoms (www.fsf.org). And OSS.

I&#039;m a student in India. I use Photoshop (pirated) for some lightweight &quot;stuff&quot; I do. As I&#039;ve already told you , I *rarely* pirate stuff. But then , I don&#039;t make a single buck out of my Photoshop work. Then why , I ask should I have to pay Adobe? The solution would be a free edition , fully working , with everything , for people like me. While the people who use Adobe products commercially *will* buy a &quot;proper&quot; product with a commercial license and probably even donate later on. I would happily have bought Photoshop if I could. However , I could only pirate it. At the mere cost of Rs. 50 , which is approximately a dollar (USD).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m black beard. No , really. Yesterday I handed my friend about a dozen novels I was done with and on past occasions , we&#8217;ve done a lot of similar stuff. And no , I&#8217;m not sorry for the [u]millions[/u] of dollars that Archer and Pan Publishing lost due to our little charade. Even after all this , they haven&#8217;t knocked on my door yet. I believe they won&#8217;t be  doing so soon.</p>
<p>Every industry has to face it , and draw a line between &#8220;lending&#8221; and &#8220;piracy&#8221;. Let&#8217;s say , I dump a pile of books outside my door and put up a post it note , &#8220;These books do [u]not[/u] belong to me. Pick up at your own risk. May be radioactive.&#8221; That is in no way illegal. The piratebay guys were doing something similar. Essentially , piracy should not be illegal , but it is and will always be morally wrong , and so it should be stopped , as that&#8217;s even more reason for companies (think Redmond) to make things heavily DRM laden. Additionally , if nothing is done soon , governments like The Government , will be making laws that will stop piracy. And our three fundamental freedoms (www.fsf.org). And OSS.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m a student in India. I use Photoshop (pirated) for some lightweight &#8220;stuff&#8221; I do. As I&#8217;ve already told you , I *rarely* pirate stuff. But then , I don&#8217;t make a single buck out of my Photoshop work. Then why , I ask should I have to pay Adobe? The solution would be a free edition , fully working , with everything , for people like me. While the people who use Adobe products commercially *will* buy a &#8220;proper&#8221; product with a commercial license and probably even donate later on. I would happily have bought Photoshop if I could. However , I could only pirate it. At the mere cost of Rs. 50 , which is approximately a dollar (USD).</p>
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		<title>By: FredFredrickson</title>
		<link>http://blog.martincrownover.com/2009/04/21/swashbuckling-under-pressure/comment-page-1/#comment-4845</link>
		<dc:creator>FredFredrickson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 30 Apr 2009 06:32:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://blog.martincrownover.com/?p=1087#comment-4845</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s erroneous thinking, flank.  The continuation of piracy isn&#039;t going to stop the internet, but it will stop the internet from being the open, free place it is now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s erroneous thinking, flank.  The continuation of piracy isn&#8217;t going to stop the internet, but it will stop the internet from being the open, free place it is now.</p>
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